Hello,

Friends of mine, a couple from Europe, are coming to Ontario in June, 2009 with their own folding kayak. They have done kayaking in many places in Europe (Italy, Portugal, Spain, Poland, Romania, Germany, Lithuania and others), so I’d consider them quite experienced kayakers.

After examining maps of Ontario, they decided on the following route:

The put in point: Highway 69 & French River.
Paddle to Lake Nippissing (via the French River Main Channel or French River North Channel).
Paddle on Lake Nippissing to North Bay.
From North Bay paddle on the Mattawa River to the Ottawa River.
Paddle on the Ottawa River to Ottawa (they’re planning to meet friends in Algonquin Park, camp there for a couple of days and take a side trip to Montreal, by car, of course!).
Then from Ottawa paddle on the Rideau Canal to Kingston.

A friend of theirs will drop them off at the put-in point, but otherwise they don’t have a car. They’re planning to camp in provincial parks (French River, Samuel de Champlain), on crown land and on private campgrounds. Of course, they know there will be numerous portages along the way.

I have given them as many pieces of information as I have found, but since I have never paddled in that area, it’s not possible for me to provide them with a definitive advice and so I’d appreciate if you could post your comments/suggestions/advice on any aspects of such a trip. I have Kevin Callan’s “Killarney and French River”, which describes the first part of their route, from highway 69 to Lake Nipissing, but I do not have much info on the rest of the route. I think the Rideau Canal part of this trip should be relatively easy, so the main concern would be the portion from the French River to Ottawa. In particular, they have the following questions:

• What do you think about this route? Is it doable? I was especially wondering about the crossing of Nipissing Lake.
• Are the many portages on the Mattawa River and Ottawa River? How long & difficult are they?
• Are there any rapids, obstacles or other obstructions they should consider, especially on the Mattawa & Ottawa Rivers?
• Are the any stores close to the Mattawa & Ottawa River where they can buy food?
• Are there any private/public/crown land campsites along the Mattawa and Ottawa River, as well as along the Rideau Canal?
• How many days should they budget on such a trip?

I’d appreciate any information you can provide, I will forward it to them.

Jack

Can't help you much.....what kind of kayaking have they done, an awful lot of flatwater on your proposed route and many areas would be hard to classify as "wilderness".

Info for the Rideau Canal section here:

http://www.rideau-info.com/canal/canoe/index.html

Wow!! Well I can answer most of this (I think). I live and play in North Bay (on Lake Nipissing). But I'll have to do a little research first and get back to this thread (I wouldn't want to steer them wrong). Just with things like who might shuttle them etc.

I will say that Lake Nipissing is doable on a calm day. But it is a shallow lake that kicks up big BIG waves. Because of the topography around the area it can appear glass calm on one side of the lake while treacherously dangerous on another part of it. I have canoed, kayaked and motor boated it frequently. It will take you anywhere from 4 to 6 even 8 hours to cross it.

North Bay to Trout Lake (Mattawa River Route) you'll need to shuttle through. It technically can be paddled with portaging, but you'll be going through private land, where there is some contention by the land owners. I have heard that they made exceptions by permission in advance. I can hook you up with Friends Of The Le Vase River in a later post. (or if you're in a hurry look them up yourself, they are online). Also Canoe and Kayak Company I think is related to them, and I believe shuttles vehicles also.

Again, I'll come back after some research, but I will also say now that the Ottawa River is one you'll need to plan out well. For long stretches there's just NO WHERE to camp.. Steep shoreline is just undo-able for much of the river from Mattawa. So I'll give you some tips and suggestions where to camp. Not to mention the dams. And I think you have to PAY to cross (portage them), even by canoe).

Anyway, I'll get back to ya.

Jack, I can speak for the Mattawa River portion of the trip as I have paddled it several times from the west end of Trout Lake into the town of Mattawa.

There are approximately 14 portages, mostly short ones (between 30 m. to perhaps 200 m.) The one at Talon Chute is a little mountain goat like but still manageable. Alexander Mackenzie referred to this portage as the most difficult one between Lachine and Grand Portage, mind you they were dragging 36 foot watersoaked birch bark canoes.

As for campsite, when I travelled , summer time, the premier campsites in places like Turtle Lake, Graswell Point, Elm Point, were taken up by 'permanent ' campers. But there are other sites, but not as good.

The town of Mattawa is a pretty little town with an organized campground. Has grocery store.

The Mattawa is a relaxing river with lots of history to boot.

Not sure if I missed something in your note, but the Madawaska appears a couple of times. Is this a side trip into Algonquin, or did you mean to say Mattawa??

Some points to add:

* they are paddling a folding kayak, possibly a Klepper Aerius

If that's the case, it's a pig to carry over long portages. Short ones are fine, and the portage is done by the paddlers carrying each end.
They will probably have a cart and should take it along - it will help on the longer stretches but be a pain in the butt on bumpy or obstructed portages. They'll need patience, but it's doable....

* for the big lakes like Nipissing or even the lake-like Ottawa, they should take their spray cover and thus will be able to handle most weather conditions

* North Bay is best handled by taxi. But getting in touch with the friends of the LaVase should be an oppportunity not to be missed. Maybe the canoe crew will take them through - but I'd leave the folding kayak with someone while they are doing that stretch.

* for the canal portions, they should do whatever they can to be allowed to float through the locks. I don't know what it takes, but it would help them to have a relaxed trip.

Overall - they'll have a good time and I admire their spunk in considering this trip.

Regarding meeting friends in Algonquin Park, your description sounds like they plan to exit the Ottawa and paddle up the Madawaska River. I don't think this idea makes much sense.
Very arduous, a couple hundred KM much unmaintained, very swift upstream. Thier friends should meet them on the Ottawa River.

Most parties heading up the French from Hwy 69 take the north channel around Eighteen Mile Island, through Cedar Rapids.
Your friends will find a lot of French River information at
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31544

Erhard's write-up of the La Vase portage, and several Mattawa trip reports, are given at
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=31543

About the only information I have on that stretch of the Ottawa, except that it has some very big rapids, comes from Eric Morse's "Fur Trade Canoe Routes of Canada".

Like others, I don't understand the route as described. How are they going to get from Ottawa to Algonquin?

People have got to stop using Google Maps for planning canoe/kayak trips!

That's kind of joking, but seriously....exactly what maps have they been looking at?

I get the feeling that the real-life distances are going to come as quite a shock.

Take a look in the Routes folder for the different segments:
http://www.myccr.com/canoedb/on.htm

This sounds like a lot of ground transport is going to be needed. Lots more planning involved in that phase.


Where in Algonquin?
http://www.algonquinadventures.com/trip ... sIndex.htm

A "side trip" to Montreal! From Algonquin!

So....from Ottawa west to Algonquin, back east to Montreal, then back to Ottawa and on to Kingston? Ay caramba.

You don't state the amount of time that this is supposed to entail. Or their method of packing, portaging, what type of food, or really any kind of hard details that need to go into this kind of planning.

To my way of thinking, it would be better to pick ONE of the proposed routes, do a lot more research, and enjoy a well-planned trip.

If the main focus is meeting with friends in Algonquin, then that should be the starting point. Trying to cover all this distance in one trip sounds overly ambitious to me. But then, I'm a stop and see the sights type of person.

And I would never go to Algonquin in June.....the blackflies are just too atrocious.



Barbara

I gotta go further and say that your friends should not travel the French-Mattawa-Ottawa without reading Eric Morse's book. If they don't read it or similar material, all they are doing is taking a canoe trip.
Yours in paddling, Allan

Yup, that proposed route is about 750km - excluding the Algonquin/Montreal jaunt which I think is meant to be driven in their friends' car.

The season they picked is heavy bug season as Barbara has pointed out, and that's OK with them, at least they should buy bug shirts and bring cotton gloves:


http://www.bugshirt.com/

I wouldn't worry about that giving them advice as we have done: most of my visitors from overseas underestimate the distances and during their trips discover that they need to adjust the plans. They do and it's no big deal. The reward of the trip is the travel itself and not the attainment of the specific destination. It does put a dent into bragging rights, though....

If they decide to do only a partial section of that trip, they should understand the characteristics of each leg:

A wonderful trip through outstanding Canadian Shield country. One meets the occasional boat, but it's perceived as mostly natural.

Spectacular route with perceivable history connection: you are traveling the same paths that three centuries of explorers have trodden, step by step and paddle stroke by paddle stroke.

I haven't paddled it but suspect it might be a bit boring: no perceivable current and just lake after lake separated by industrial dams. But there are towns along the way for shopping and there are a handful of places where white water rafting happens - so it might be OK.

I suppose it's a quaint trip, with power boaters and cottagers along the way but nice nature - probably the closest to the European trips that they have done in the past. They should consider staying in B@Bs along the way, in addition to tenting.

Hello,

Wow... I’m overwhelmed by your replies!!! Thank you very much! I won’t be able to contact my friends for some time, but I can tell you what I know about their trip.

It was totally their idea to do this kind of trip. Since I’ve never paddled on those rivers (except the French River—but only from Hartley Bay to Georgian Bay), and since I’ve never actually done any kayaking, I have refrained from giving them any advice on the technical/safety aspects of this trip—that’s why I am trying to find out more info here. Yet I do believe they’re quite experienced and are aware it’s not an easy trip.

Recped: thanks for the link, I will forward it to them in case they don’t have it.

Swift: Thanks for your info on Lake Nipissing, the Mattawa and Ottawa Rivers. I’m sure they will have more questions and it would be great if I could get answers.

Moe F: I appreciate your info on the Mattawa, portages stores. Sorry—of course, I meant MATTAWA, not Madawaska!!! I’ve already corrected it.

Erhard: Thanks for your comments. I don’t know what kind of kayak they have, but it appears they are prepared for portaging. However, I will of course mention your concerns. I will also tell them about the distance. Well... I hope they know what they’re getting into, I’d never venture to take such a trip, but my paddling objectives, interests and abilities are simply different... besides, I don’t kayak and limit my portages to the minimum. I know the French River route is well-documented and I don’t think they should have any problems with it. In fact, I suggested that they focus more on Georgian Bay, Killarney and French River near Georgian Bay—I even have a book “Kayaking on Georgian Bay”. Of course, I know that the Rideau Canal part of the trip won’t be in the wilderness, but they’re OK with that, they said they would like to meet other people and don’t mind the surrounding ‘civilization’.

Alscool: Sorry, I meant MATTAWA, not Madawaska. Must have looked at the other river while browsing the map... the human mind sometimes works in inexplicable ways! I have already corrected that in my original post.

Allan Jacobs: thanks for the advice about the North Channel. Regarding their stay at Algonquin Park, I guess they will stop somewhere along the Ottawa River and will be picked up by their friend to spend a couple days in the park, then will drive back and resume the trip, but I don’t know the details. I will mention the book, I don’t know how good their English is.

Barbara: I have no idea what kind of maps they have... but probably yes, the ones online... I will forward them the link. The trip to Montreal will be by car—again, I guess they will leave their equipment somewhere.

Regarding their itinerary: they’re planning to start on June 13, 2009 at Highway 69 & French River. June 24—reaching North Bay. They want to reach Ottawa River and paddle as far as possible on Ottawa till July 3. July 4-13: meeting friends in Algonquin, driving to Ottawa and Montreal (don’t know exact details). July 14—resuming the trip (I assume somewhere along Ottawa River and paddling south on the Rideau Canal towards Kingston. July 29—reaching Kingston, end of the trip.

I’ve already told them about the black fly (that’s why you never see me in June up north), but I will once again advise them about this annoying insect.

I will contact them and discuss all the issues brought up here; if they have any other questions, I hope I will be able to post them here too.

Once again, I appreciate your assistance!

Regards,


Jack

Well, they have done the trip and are still smiling:



The route was shortened a bit and thus all worked out. They'll tell you more about it when they return home.

I'm looking forward to it.Would have loved to paddle a lenght with them,however Iwas out east on my own adventure.

I'm guessing they paddled to pembroke then got a pick up there?Went to Algonquin and called it at that?

I don't know the whole story nor do I want to preempt their tale with whatever I heard - they have a website and a readership of their own and I am sure it's a big thing with those. Let's just wait until they have a chance to "talk" on their terms.

If you want specific info - I have some on the Ottawa leg of their trip and would share via PM.

I've been bouncing some emails back and forth with Celina and have permission to post them here:

(she was contacted by someone else for advice - that's the funny part, that they are now "expert" on this part of Ontario's major historical route. Good for them! ....but they do ask for some addditional advice on the rapids where the river has split and I guess that's the Beachburg section where rafters play....)