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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 5:33 pm 
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Joined: September 6th, 2004, 1:02 am
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Location: Wellington, ON
I know I'll likely get beat-up for this, but I'm going to ask what today's conventional thinking is...

The weather forecast in Killarney from tomorrow until Tuesday looks better than it has for some time, so if I don't change my mind again, I'm outta here tomorrow! I'll be going solo into the interior a few portages. I haven't decided where yet.

I bought a new MSR stove (the cheapie model for about $70) to replace my aging Coleman Peak I. Should I awake during the night a little on the cool side, and with a the flap and roof vent open slightly, what's the current thinking of firing up the stove for a while to warm things up?

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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 5:50 pm 
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Joined: November 7th, 2003, 5:57 pm
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Location: Cambridge Ontario
I don't think todays modern tents and flames mix too well. But fired up outside and a hot drink and hot water bottle can do wonders for getting back to sleep. We have also noticed our candle lantern(small contained flame)hung in the tent can make it warmer inside. But never, for safety's sake go to sleep with it going.

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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 6:15 pm 
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Ooh, I'm not looing forward to seeing that news story posted on the site! If it were me, I'd probably light the stove, roll over, go back to sleep, kick the stove over in my sleep, etc. Ouch.

Use the stove before bed, make a thermos of something and/or take a Nalgene of hot water to bed with you.
Hey, if need be, you could even refill your Nalgene in the middle of the night with fresh hot water from a thermos. but be careful, you can burn yourself this way too - a Nalgene of freshly boiled water is hot, hot, hot.

Pat.


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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 6:27 pm 
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Please don't. Take a spare blanket or extra long johns or sweater - anything but starting up a stove in a small tent. I keep thinking about dead from carbon monoxide poisoning or a very fast fire and burning plastics stick to the skin like glue.

cheers, Ted


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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 7:14 pm 
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Bonk - that's me hitting you on the top of your head with a big stick.
Take more clothes, an extra sleeping bag, two thermos' , eat some cheese and almonds throughout the night - anything but lighting your stove in the tent.
That should be pretty clear eh.


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PostPosted: November 5th, 2004, 7:25 pm 
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Okay, you all have convinced me, even though I know better. Thanks for the many suggestions, some I hadn't thought of.

I'm psyching myself up for this trip, last minute packing, etc. This'll be my first cool-weather trip in close to 40 years, and 2nd only solo trip! Even if I have lousy weather and a not-so-great time, I know I'll think back on it fondly in the middle of Winter.

Thanks again.

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PostPosted: November 6th, 2004, 10:10 am 
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Hey Inhaliburton,

Slap! That's an extra cuff in the side of the head for good measure, just in case Rick's club did not register!

Hey, you'll be fine. No bugs! WuuHooo! Seriously, your bigger worry is staying dry. Bring a good tarp, and make sure your tent is water proof. Temperature around +5 to -3 is the toughest to deal with. Its hypothermia weather if its raining, since nothing dries unless the sun comes out. And November is about the cloudiest time of the year. If the sun comes out though, its glorious!

If you have to consider an open flame in a little nylon tent, you were too cheap on buying your sleeping bag! The archives have lots and lots of postings on this topic. Since your bag is a little on the thin side, bring fleece layers and a touque for sleeping in. Enjoy.


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PostPosted: November 6th, 2004, 11:42 am 
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Hi Hoop,

Ouch, that hurts! I've got 3 bags, all of them down. One's a summer bag, another one is a Black's bag (Northland) that's good to about -5 to -10C, and a 3rd bag I bought for half-price ($200) back in the '80s at Eddie Bauer on Bloor St. Those were the days when EB used to sell high-end camping gear instead of designer clothing, as they do now. It's a mummy bag that rated down to -35C and I've never used it.

I'm going to take the lighter two bags.

It's partly sunny up here now, and I'm still packing...

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PostPosted: November 6th, 2004, 12:01 pm 
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Bring a thick towel along and use it to wrap a hot stone from the fire and bring it in the tent with you. Position it so you won't kick it loose and melt the tent floor or walls. But its probably not going to keep warm all night.


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PostPosted: November 6th, 2004, 12:11 pm 
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Wear a toque in bed........Fill a Nalgene bottle with hot water........ insulate yourself from the ground under you.........put 1 sleeping bag inside the other......... if you are at all damp, sleep in the nude :o

I'm willing to bet that if you do this, you will be too hot :D

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PostPosted: November 7th, 2004, 2:53 am 
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Good move about the two bags; used together they are a good winter bag.

But don't make the mistake of underestimating the amount of insulation needed between you and the ground. I almost always these days carry two foam pads, and it makes a significant difference.

/Par


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 Post subject: Cold
PostPosted: November 7th, 2004, 11:44 am 
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Location: Listowel, Ontario Canada
When winter camping, I always take a sleeping bag size roll of double foil insulation as an underpad. This material is very light and not only prevents cold from coming up from underneigth but also reflects body heat back. This furnace pipe wrap insulation can be purchased from your local Home Hardware store or building centre. The wrap is white on one side with a layer of sandwiched bubble material and foil on the other side, comes in a variety of widths and works very well as a sleep pad when incorperated with a therma-rest. Happy camping!


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PostPosted: November 7th, 2004, 11:53 am 
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Tommy wrote:
Bring a thick towel along and use it to wrap a hot stone from the fire and bring it in the tent with you. Position it so you won't kick it loose and melt the tent floor or walls. But its probably not going to keep warm all night.


Great suggestion about the stone. I have done this exact same thiing with excellent results.

Boneli

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PostPosted: November 7th, 2004, 8:45 pm 
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I think it makes sense to check the practices of those who commonly camp in cold conditions, throughout the year, and have a century of written history about doing so on uncountable outings: mountain climbers and polar explorers. In the literature I've read, and my own limited experience, I can't recall one instance of someone starting a stove in a tent in the middle of the night to warm up, and a statistically insignificant number of cases of people freezing to death during the night.

For reassurance it might be worth getting a copy of the mountaineering "bible" from the library: "Mountaineering, Freedom of the Hills".

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PostPosted: November 8th, 2004, 9:29 am 
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If you wake up cold at night, scrunch up into a ball and tense your muscles until you're warmed up. Putting on some clothes might not be the most romantic if you're with your sweetie, but insulation is insulation, and a layer of fleece will help keep you warm.

The traditional way to warm up in the bush around here was to get the fire going again and then go back to sleep for as long as the fire kept going, but modern sleeping bags aren't designed for this and there'll matchhead-sized holes from sparks, since the fire needs to be kept large for enough warmth.

The boiling water in the nalgene works well, especially since it'll need to be wrapped in a towel, too hot otherwise, and the heat wiill stay for at least a couple of hours of sleep. I suppose the stove could be started up outside the tent and the water reboiled if necessary, like getting the campfire going again for another several hours of sleep, but it's easier just to have enough insulation on hand to keep things warm underneath.

The good thing about cold weather is that it'll wake you up to remind you that you need to warm up while you're still alive and kicking, unlike some of those tent heaters that might still be out there.

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