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 Post subject: Canoe for a Kid
PostPosted: August 9th, 2006, 8:13 am 
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Joined: March 23rd, 2005, 9:22 am
Posts: 287
Location: Wenatchee, WA
My eight year old son Theo has taken to solo paddling in my Wenonah Argosy which is 14 1/2 feet long. I am thinking he would enjoy himself even more in an appropriate size canoe. I am considering building a kid friendly wood stripper. In an earlier post the Wee Robbie by Laughing Loon was mentioned. The Wee Robbie is 10 feet six inches long with a 27 inch beam and 10 inch depth. This sounds like a good size. What I am wondering is before I go to all the work, are there other designs out there worth considering?
I have never built a canoe before, but want to. Any suggestions?


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PostPosted: August 9th, 2006, 2:08 pm 
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Joined: June 9th, 2005, 2:27 pm
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Location: Saskatoon
If you haven't been there already, head over to the Bear Mountain Boats forum. Some folks there should be able to give you some quality advice and comment on the building aspects.

Cheers,
Bryan

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PostPosted: August 10th, 2006, 10:30 am 
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Location: Wenatchee, WA
Bryan-
I looked up Bear Mountain Boats. They don't have any real small designs.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: August 11th, 2006, 3:43 pm 
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John Marshall wrote:
Bryan-
I looked up Bear Mountain Boats. They don't have any real small designs.

That's true, but the forum is another source of knowledge which reaches much beyond Bear Mountain's designs. I would recommend searching their forum archives for similar questions, or posting your own question there.
Good Luck,
Bryan

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PostPosted: August 11th, 2006, 4:23 pm 
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Joined: November 23rd, 2001, 7:00 pm
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Location: Coldstream, Ontario Canada
John I haven`t seen the Wee Robbie but the numbers make sense. This spring we changed the way canoeing was thought about for kids. I designed the first solo white water canoe for kids called the Splash. I've proven that the old way of thinking about kids and canoeing were from yester year. A number of these boats have been built and sold, its so sweet to see these young paddlers out on the waters, kids can control solo canoes prefectly even in white water with proper instruction. Like in any sport you can have an adult sized piece of equipment and a kids sized piece. To see the boat review check out this past edition of Rapid Mag. There are even some regular CCR menbers that have put their little ones in these boats.

Gail this is your chance to chin in ! :wink:

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PostPosted: August 11th, 2006, 5:12 pm 
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Location: Wenatchee, WA
Bryan-It looks like if I want to look things up on Bear Mountain, I need to register. Maybe I will do it.

Alan- Who sells the Splash? My inspiration to build a canoe for my kids comes from my son Theo. I have eight year old triplets: Sophie, Charles and Theo. Earlier this week we were at a small lake. I gave everyone a chance to canoe. Sophie chose to go tandem canoeing with Dad after dark. Theo and Charles both tried solo in my Argosy. Charles has little patience and got mad because he could not make the boat go where he wanted to. Theo has bottomless patience and spent hours in the Argosy. His method is to switch every three strokes. I have tried teaching the J to him, but he can't get the paddle very far behind him and he kills his momentum doing the J. Later on the trip, some folks came with an older style white water kayak and let Charles paddle it on the lake. Charles had no trouble making the kayak go where he wanted it to. Just goes to show that learning to canoe is harder.


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PostPosted: August 11th, 2006, 7:48 pm 
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Our girls are now 10 and 12 and both have a beautiful J along with a expanding quiver of strokes. Kids as adults pick things up differently, so don`t get discouraged if one is moving along faster than their sibling. I`ve now started doing clinics for kids and we're also involed with Camp Wanapitei, a industry leader for canoe tripping with kids. Its funny what will promote the paddling bug with kids, we`ve fould that other kids their own age will go along way in getting the kids to really want to pick up the paddle and build their skills. There are many like minded parents that have gone that extra step to getting their kids out with others the same age as their own. Our girls have been building strong friendships with other young paddlers, this has meant all the difference in the world on how quickly their skills have grown. But to give you a idea at how kids can progress, Gails youngest who has hit the ripe old age of 7 was solo paddling class I plus - II rapids this spring. Amazing !!! :D

Its great to here other parents with a strong interest in getting their little one's in solo canoes. This will go along way in promoting grass root canoeing, be it be canoe tripping or white water day trips.

If any one is interest in a intro to solo canoing for kids in Southern Ontario I`ll be doing a clinic at the MEC Paddle Fest this Sept 16th down at the Lake front in Toronto.

As far as who is selling the Splash, its either my own company "Canoe Water Adventuring" or "Composite Creations", the boat builder.

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PostPosted: August 18th, 2006, 2:20 pm 
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Try having a look at this stitch & glue. Narrow, shallow, and light enough for him to paddle on his own, and enough canoe there for him to grow into.

If nothing else, the plans are cheap enough that you could use them as a jumping off point for your own design.

http://www.riverstoneinternet.com/canoe ... canoe.html


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PostPosted: August 18th, 2006, 10:46 pm 
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:doh: having problems with double posting

I guess that's what I get for checking in with CCR while on vacation. Log in at any available computer I come across.

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Last edited by D.R.Zandee on August 18th, 2006, 10:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: August 18th, 2006, 10:49 pm 
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http://www.oldtowncanoe.com/canoes/huntingFishing/pack.html
http://www.clippercanoes.com/boat_specs.php?model_id=114
http://www.midcanscottcanoe.com/scott/canoe_models/solitude.html
https://www.mohawkcanoes.com/kidscoanoes.htm

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PostPosted: August 20th, 2006, 11:16 am 
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Its interesting is see others views on their idea of kids canoes ( I`m referring to Mohawk Canoes ) and what can make for a good canoe. First of all you have to understand the problems that develop from a poorly designed canoe. You can most certainly both see it and read it on Mohawks page. Just look at the one frontal picture of their Pack canoe ( their solo kids canoe). Simply put the boat is to wide in the midsection to allow for proper forward strokes. It tends to make the paddler sweep more because the boat is wide and does note tuck in enough near to gunnels. To the point they even referr to using a kayak paddle so that your kayaking not canoing. They even talk about stabilty with this canoe.... well they've taken the extreme on this issue. Take in consideration of both weight and center of gravity of a kid, oh and lets not forget the adult fear factor. So after these three factors are considered this boat becomes a dock. There is many ways to give that sense of stablity but also make the boat more user friendly for that smaller paddler.

Now if anyone was looking for a tandem kids canoe, anyone of these adult solo canoes wood make for a good tandem, by placing in the boat a bow and stern seat.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: August 21st, 2006, 9:04 am 
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Location: Wenatchee, WA
I am pretty much set on building a canoe for my kids as opposed to buying one. The Wee Robbie sold by Laughing Loon 10 1/2 feet, is the only plan I have come accross that is the right size.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: August 21st, 2006, 9:15 am 
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Maybe some of you boat builders can help me with this. Laughing Loon which offers the plans for the Wee Robbie calls it a double paddle boat and says it is designed to be paddled with a kayak paddle. I have a hard time believing it won't paddle just fine with a canoe paddle, but for a small kid it may be a bit of reach to the gunwales. I am thinking of putting some tumble home into it. How hard is it to modify plans? I would think I would just need to curve the forms in a bit at the top. Is this hard to get right?

http://www.laughingloon.com/wee.robbie.html


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PostPosted: August 21st, 2006, 9:26 am 
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Location: Grand Haven, Michigan U.S.A.
John,

Likely it will depend more on your expectations. I've seen several of my friends get their 7-10 year old kids into small solos (Bell Flashfire, MRC Pearl) with some success. The reach can be an issue, but it's easy enough to get a child to paddle a solo Candian style with both knees in one chine, especially on a nice calm lake where they can start working on forward strokes, J-strokes, and learning how to turn on a high brace.

So I'd say that it would be real easy for you to make a pretty usable solo for a child. Tucking in the rails with tumblehome might help some, and won't hurt the hull during most paddling with the boat flat. I'd just keep your tumblehome radius reasonably smooth so that when your child starts learning how to use boat heel to increase the rocker of the boat that there won't be any more upsets than necessary for a youngster to over come.

PK


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PostPosted: August 21st, 2006, 10:20 am 
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I would have to agree with PK. I know if I was going to build this boat, I'd bring the gunnels in with tumblehome. It should not be that hard if you first make your changes to the stations on paper stations first. The biggest thing is to having your lines flow smoothly from one station to the next while blending into the rest of the hull.

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