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 Post subject: Covering
PostPosted: April 7th, 2008, 12:20 pm 
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I've acquired a new boat that needs recovering. It originally had "verolite" on it.
I'm assuming I can put either canvass verolite or, polyester dacron on. What are the pros and cons of each of these materials?
Thxs.


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PostPosted: April 7th, 2008, 5:43 pm 
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Joined: August 27th, 2002, 7:00 pm
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Location: Geraldton, Ontario Can
If your boat had verolite on it, it was probably a tremblay. If you are going to use something like dacron, you might want to have a good look at the hull, as some of those tremblays were built pretty rough. On the ones I have "uncovered" the planking had barely been sanded before the verolite was put on. Re-canvassing them is not a problem, we have a few left still that received a re-canvasing after the verolite was peeled. I have another suggestion that will meet with scorn from the purists....but.....I sanded the exterior hull down until it was free from rough patches. Then I covered the entire hull with wide masking tape. Then I put six ounce cloth over it and clearcoat and to wet it out, system three general purpose for fill coats. same way you would do a stripper. Sanded it smooth and painted it red...looks very nice....the reason for the tape is to so the resin and glass doesn't stick to the hull. In essence, it's just a skin over the wood. I'll try to find a picture to post for you later. Many will tell you that this is a horrible thing to do, but I disagree. you end up with a very functional boat that can be ready within a week.


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PostPosted: April 8th, 2008, 12:57 pm 
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Location: Prince Edward County Ontario
Do tell, why the lack of bond between the fibreglass and the wood? Have you ever re-re-covered one? What kind of life do you get from the taped/glassed boats?

I once put scotch tape over the planking gaps to stop the resin oozing into the boat . The very first glassing left hard drips inside the canoe which needed a minigrinder to remove :roll: .

Ralph

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 8th, 2008, 1:56 pm 
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The common complaint about fiberglassing old cedar/canvas hulls is that with epoxy resins, the glass bonds with the wood. The interior of the hull is still open to the elements, and when the wood becomes wet and swells, cracking and other damage can occur. Polyester resin doesn't do the same thing, because it tends not to bond with the wood, but most canoes that are glassed over tend to develop rot faster than canvas canoes, as the canvas allows the wood to dry more completely. The canoes I have had that were glassed over have been quite durable, and are still being paddled.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 8th, 2008, 8:07 pm 
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Joined: March 1st, 2007, 6:29 pm
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The use of tape to keep the glass and resin away from the wood should work quite well. I have done similiar with a few boat repairs in the past. Not traditional but it keeps the cedar canoes on the water. With cedar canvas boats the storage in the off times is still the most important.Brian


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 8th, 2008, 9:11 pm 
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Quote:
If you are going to use something like dacron, you might want to have a good look at the hull, as some of those tremblays were built pretty rough.

Is this because the dacron is thin and every little variation in the wood will show through? Will a clinch nail coming out rip the dacron easily?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 9th, 2008, 6:21 am 
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I've never worked with dacron, but the tremblay hulls tended to have wide variations of imperfections that would even show up through the canvas when we recanvased them. I have seen some of the exterior sides of the planking that still had bark from the trees on it. So no, it's not the nails I worry about. Verolite actually covered quite well and looked nice (until the sun got to it). Are you keen on saving weight?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 9th, 2008, 9:43 am 
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Quote:
Are you keen on saving weight?

Yes. I do more lifting than paddling it sometimes seems. I have to work boats out of a crowded garage to the car, to the water and back for an afterwork paddle. It would be more pleasant to have less weight.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 9th, 2008, 11:15 am 
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Well, no matter what skin you put on the tremblay (is it a tremblay), you are going to have some weight to it. Is it a 16 footer? huron model? I've never weighed mine, but dry as a bone I'm guessing it's close to 80...after a week with the wood soaking up water...it weighs "urgh". I've never weighed the fiberglass skin, but it probably adds five to ten pounds...probably similar to a canvas skin...perhaps lighter than veroltie...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 9th, 2008, 8:25 pm 
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Quote:
Well, no matter what skin you put on the tremblay (is it a tremblay), you are going to have some weight to it. Is it a 16 footer? huron model?
Yes, Huron, 16ft.(actually a little less 15'9") with verolite, by Trembley I believe. It doesn't seem really heavy at the moment but I haven't weighed it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 16th, 2008, 10:43 pm 
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You can still purchase verolite through trailhead ( special order -4 weeks) @ $30.00 yd-60" w. Seems to be quite a sturdy light material that is thick enough to hide some of the imperfections. A canoe builder told me it was not easy to put on comparatively with canvass. You don't have to wait for filler to dry: put it on put it in. Only colour available is green.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 17th, 2008, 6:29 am 
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With taxes, that's going to be a little over 200 bucks for the verolite, which is probably about a hundred dollars cheaper than re-canvasing. Like you say, you could have the boat in the water the next day. Tremblay used a staple gun to attach the verolite to the canoes we had. The reason it will be somewhat difficult to put on is because it is quick thick and doesn't stretch at all, so you might have to do some inventive cutting to get a seamless tight fit. I don't think verolite is as tough as a good canvas job. We always ended up replacing the verolite within a few years. It's prone to easy "slices". It is however, easy to repair, and duck tape sticks to it quite well. It also is very susceptible to UV rays...even storing it indoors, the colour will fade. If you decide to go that route, let me know how it works out, I might be interested in applying it to one we have left. One last thing....I wouldn't re-attach the keel. The canoe will track fine without it, and you really don't want to be poking holes in that verolite to drive screws through. As soon as you r keel hits something, the screws will drag and shift, and you will start to leak.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 17th, 2008, 8:00 pm 
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Joined: February 23rd, 2007, 8:05 pm
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Location: Kingston, Ontario, CANADA
Alex1 wrote:
Quote:
Well, no matter what skin you put on the tremblay (is it a tremblay), you are going to have some weight to it. Is it a 16 footer? huron model?
Yes, Huron, 16ft.(actually a little less 15'9") with verolite, by Trembley I believe. It doesn't seem really heavy at the moment but I haven't weighed it.



This look like your boat???:


http://lh5.ggpht.com/trinitymike1964/SA ... G_0224.jpg



If so, then you got a Tremblay Huron...


And oddly enough, that's the original covering AFAIK...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 17th, 2008, 9:23 pm 
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Can't access that photo. The sticker on the boat says "le Huron Indian M.P. canoe, made in village Huron". There is also a name burnt/stained into the front deck. I can only make out the 1rst name "Jacques".

I thought that shoe keels were to protect the bottem of the canoe. The keel on this is maybe 3/4" and doesn't look good for much. I didn't realize they were a liability.

Verolite does not stretch AT ALL?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: April 17th, 2008, 9:40 pm 
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Joined: June 15th, 2007, 9:26 pm
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Location: chelsea
Verolite is a more difficult material to stretch than canvas but is still a manageable project to do at home. Work using the traditional method of stretching longtitudinally with a come-along and with downward tension through weight in the canoe or posts wedged from the ceiling into the boat. Get the "Wood Canvas Canoe" from the library, think it through, plan it out and go slow.
A couple of notes for verolite boats...do all interior varnishing before covering, as Rob says keep them out of the sun, and use an exterior silicone as sealant. Oh, and I wouldn't bother with a keel either.


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