View topic - little Pic River

Does anyone have any info on paddling this river?

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Time's but a golden wind that shakes the grass...

Rob Haslam does,
I can tell you about the bottom 6 k's.
If you check out the sat images on this site it is really cool.
It is on my list of want to's.
When we did our pole/paddle up it was 2.53 on the gauges.
http://wateroffice.ec.gc.ca/google_map/ ... oSearch=Go
The river at this level I think could be done, it would be boney though.
Biggest trouble would be when you decide to paddle.
Neys P.P. opens late in the season and closes early in the fall.
Which limits take out options.
Quite a climb out by Hwy 17.
If the rest of the river is like the last 6 k it should be spectacular.
I know it is on Rob's list to re-establish.

Jeff

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Choosing to save a river is more often an act of passion than of careful calculation. You make the choice because the river has touched your life in an intimate and irreversible way, because you are unwilling to accept its loss. — (David Bolling, Ho

Yes, it is on the reopen list, maybe next summer. Every year we plan to do it, but a different route takes over. Used to start it from Mackay Lake outside of Longlac, but I think there might be some jackpots created by forestry on some of the key ports. We intend to start somewhere around Caramat. I do have maps, but they must be taken with some caution, as the last update was 1994.

Lake Caramat? Ending at Neys? Number of Days on the river?
Can you give me a brief route description?
Problems with low water levels in midsummer?
Maybe we could accompany you and your chain saw and coordinate the shuttle.

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Time's but a golden wind that shakes the grass...

If one were to start at Longlac, would the sequence of portages over to the river follow something like this?

Eaglecrest-Little Pic-Yucca-Sun-Little Pic R

Trying to figure out if this is a worthwhile adventure. It's an option for this summer.... I figure rough 230km of travel from longlac to Neys. Starting at Seagram looks more appealing... and would shave off 25-30km of paddling.

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My Backcountry Website: www.explorethebackcountry.com

Where are you getting your idea about going from Eagle crest to Little Pic? That was done once by our club, many many years ago, and it was only done as an emergency escape, and from all accounts, it would make Meta creek look like a walk in the park. That whole area was burned abut a decade ago too. I'll check bing to see if there are any new roads back there, but I'm not sure it would be doable.

Why not just start in Longlac and go down the Steel to Santoy? That's doable, although some of the ports will be rough. Starting at Twomey or Greham would make more sense. If you start at Seagram, you will have a 2.5 k port on an old logging road to get from McKay to McLeod.

Haha! Because I bushwhack a lot on the trips I typically take. It seems like the most optimal roue to the headwaters. There's a big logging road through there now, so there is only about 1.2km of possible bushwhacking spaced out over two portages. Quite possibly less if we want to extend the logging road march another 2.6km (which may be better than a bushwack!). Some of the trails are hard to discern from the orthos...

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My Backcountry Website: www.explorethebackcountry.com

I believe the best way to access the Little Pic now is through Caramat. If you wait a couple of days, I'll scan our old maps and email them to you. You could PM me your email address if interested.

If you are planning the Little Pic in summer hope for rain.
In 2015 I paddled/poled up the Little Pic to where it turns north east.
Level on the Hydrometric scale was 2.53
And that was boney.
Even at that level the rapid where it turns NE was too shallow to run/pole.
That is why I stopped there.
Less and you will be walking everything.
I Rob info is pretty awesome!
If you look on the SAT shots you will see the huge log jams are still there.
Check with the park people and see if they have any of the logging info,
There might be some neat stuff to look for.
Jeff

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Choosing to save a river is more often an act of passion than of careful calculation. You make the choice because the river has touched your life in an intimate and irreversible way, because you are unwilling to accept its loss. — (David Bolling, Ho

Thanks Rob. I can certainly wait. It's not like the ice is going to break up tomorrow... (I wish!)
June was the target run, but as Jeff pointed out, water levels could be fickle. I always try to scrounge up some info on a few possible routes in a region and ultimately decide based on water levels as the date nears.

Jeff I saw your photos. Seems to be one of the only sets of the Little Pic online.... chatted with some folks who used to work at the park. They weren't able to provide much additional info as the park only encompasses the river mouth of the Little Pic. They have apparently been doing a decent amount of work on their backpacking trails and canoe/kayak in sites....

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My Backcountry Website: www.explorethebackcountry.com

Paddled the Little Pic last week from Killala Lake Road bridge to Hwy 17 with an average water level of 2.8m. A map is available at the link below as a JPEG or georeferenced PDF.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ecs0amwrcmab ... AVnEa?dl=0

Based on what I saw, I don't believe the route has been traveled in 20+ years, possibly since the Geraldton High School Outers Club did it in 1994. No trace left of ports until you hit the second last falls where there's a dilapidated trapper's cabin and a weak trail...didn't even find one cut log. I cut trails but was rushed so they need more work. Thanks to Rob Haslam for sending me the maps and info from that trip, which were originally produced by John Arts.

Next summer, Biigtigong Nishnaabeg plans to clear the river from the headwaters which will extend the route beyond this map.

If you want to see a video of the route, it will be available shortly:
https://youtu.be/MJ9cshlYZ_Y

As per the write-up on the map:
This 77km route from the Killala Lake Road bridge to the finish
point north of the Highway 17 is wild and seldom traveled.
Intermediate canoe tripping and whitewater skills are required.
A minimum of four days should be allotted due to the potential
for difficult overland travel and fluctuating water levels. As a
soloist clearing most of the trails, it took me six days. The
river is primarily a brook (speckled) trout fishery until after the
last falls at which point almost any species could be
encountered, due to the linkage to Lake Superior. This could
range from salmon to walleye to muskie.

Notes:
-Swifts are not marked on the map.
-Rapids classifications may change seasonally.
-The average water level for this trip at the end of September
was 2.8m and this provided ample water for flatwater sections
and reasonable water for most runnable whitewater sections.
2.2m is about as low as the river normally gets, and 2.5m
should be considered a minimum for attempting this route.
Search for Water Office's Real-Time Hydrometric Data for
current conditions.
-The current is appreciable for many kilometres south of the
last falls.
-River banks are consistently steep and muddy.
-Viable campsites are few and far between, and will likely
require clearing.
-Portages are rough and may be difficult to follow. Use this
map in Avenza Maps (a free app) to follow the tracks on this
map using GPS. There is no cell phone signal on the route,
but GPS is not dependent on cell reception.
-Additional portages are needed to avoid awkward and/or
dangerous lining and wading.
-Forestry access roads to the top of the route are in good
condition as of October 2019.
-The start point is accessed via Highway 17 > Deadhorse
Road > Jackpine Road > Vein Lake Road West > Killala Lake
Road.
-The short road to the access point at the south end of the
route is in fair condition.

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YouTube Channel - Lost Lakes

Hey Jonathan, watched the video, really good! What condition was the Deadhorse in? Heard two years ago it was in pretty bad shape.

Jonathan, great new video! Lisa and I watched it on our big screen yesterday. No plans to follow in your footsteps on that route anytime soon. Looking forward, though, to Part 2.

Thanks Rob & Martin Part 2 is on the way for tonight.

Yeah I'm not sure the video is going to draw as many users as I would like

Deadhorse was actually in very reasonable shape. Some wet spots, some potholes, but really nothing crazy. Most of the time I was confidently driving 60-70km/h. Funny enough, the "downstream" roads were in even better shape than Deadhorse. Jackpine Rd was pretty smooth except for one notable washout which reduced it to one lane, and then Vein Lake Road West was the best one of them all. It's on a bed of sand and quite dry so it has aged very gently. Then it's a short jaunt down Killala Lake Road to the bridge which is so-so in condition, but even a sedan could handle it.

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YouTube Channel - Lost Lakes