View topic - Stripper Keel / Stem Repair. Easiest / Best Method?

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PostPosted: May 21st, 2019, 7:23 pm 
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As Mr Haslam has advised use layers.
Sand back to wood.
Brush on a good quality epoxy.
Apply fiberglass over the area as long and as wide as you want.
Wet it out with epoxy.
Keep applying successive layers of glass and epoxy until you have a built up a patch.
Each layer can be smaller than the one preceding.
Let dry/cure and then sand fairing out the patch so it blends into the hull.
Apply finish of choice.
It is not a difficult job. Watch a youtube video on glassing first.
Good luck.


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2019, 10:38 am 
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A brass stem band would sure look nice. The stems beyond/beside the narrow band would still benefit from some extra layers of cloth and epoxy.

If I am laying cloth on high wear area stems the last or outermost layer is going to be Dynel.


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2019, 12:39 pm 
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After taking a look at options, I think the best choice for me will be brass stems. Keeps with the stripper style, will be durable, and easy to install. I'm going to pick up a fiberglass repair kit from the store and go ahead and get these spots patched up.

Now for the delaminated spots, should I just cut/sand that whole part down, or can I pour epoxy into the crack, clamp it, and then let it cure?


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PostPosted: May 22nd, 2019, 1:04 pm 
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Where are you picking up the fibreglass repair kit? Make sure you get a good epoxy resin and the right hardener for the clear finish.

Hazed_blue wrote:
...
Now for the delaminated spots, should I just cut/sand that whole part down, or can I pour epoxy into the crack, clamp it, and then let it cure?


Cut out the delaminated section of cloth and then sand the edges to blend into the wood. The sanding will also show you if any more of the nearby cloth is loose too. Then cut a patch of fibreglass with rounded as opposed to square corners/edges and apply the traditional 3 coats of epoxy. If you let the epoxy dry fully between coats, then you can sand the edges of the patch to blend it in before applying the final coat of epoxy. This approach has worked really well for me. When I know where to look I can find the patch but if you aren't specifically looking for the patch then it doesn't show up afterwards.

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PostPosted: May 27th, 2019, 6:17 am 
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Splake wrote:
Where are you picking up the fibreglass repair kit? Make sure you get a good epoxy resin and the right hardener for the clear finish.

MEC has a fiberglass / epoxy resin repair kit that looked appropriate, I'll probably go with that one.

Quick note, should I be using a respirator when applying and sanding this? I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I'll be doing this outisde.

Thanks for the suggestion to cut out all the delaminated stuff instead of just filling it in. Definitely located some wood on the bottom of the keel that had darkened from water exposure. It's all sanded and bright now, ready for a coating.


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PostPosted: May 27th, 2019, 8:13 am 
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Is it the G-Flex repair kits you're looking at?

https://www.mec.ca/en/search?org_text=epoxy&text=epoxy

West Systems is good, but what you need for putting on new glass is the 105 resin and 207 special hardener.

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PostPosted: May 27th, 2019, 9:12 am 
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I had initially been looking at this one:
https://www.mec.ca/en/product/5001-129/ ... Repair-Kit
EDIT: oh but you know what, this is polyester, not epoxy, huh? Probably not the one to go with then?

If there's a more suitable kit that you know of, by all means point me in that direction. It's just a small section so if I can avoid buying a huge jug of the stuff I'd like to.


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PostPosted: May 27th, 2019, 9:47 am 
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Hmmm - that one is a polyester resin. I can pretty much guarantee that your canoe was built using an epoxy resin. There's a good chance it was West Systems although both System 3 and MAS are pretty common too.


Noah's Marine in Toronto sells West Systems including a couple of patch kits:

http://www.noahsmarine.com/wsmp_west-sy ... -pack.html

The patch kits have the 205 hardener which isn't guaranteed to give you that crystal clear finish but it will be a much better option than a polyester resin.

How big are the spots you need to patch? The patch kits are a good size for a field repair but might get to be pricey if you have larger spots that need repairing. It looks like Noah's sells a 1 quart container of the 105 resin and a .33 pint container of the 207 hardener. The resin, hardener and a pump set would run you about $100. The pumps are calibrated to give you proper mixing ratios of resin and hardener. The resin and hardener also have a shelf life measured in years so if you have extra you can keep it around for the future.

As for safety equipment, a dust mask is always recommended when sanding, even outdoors now.

When applying the resin, using an organic vapour respirator doesn't hurt. (eg: https://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/stan ... p.html#srp ) Some people do develop an allergic reaction to the resin. Working outside will give you plenty of ventilation which is the primary requirement.

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PostPosted: June 23rd, 2019, 1:08 pm 
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Update:

First epoxy coat down. I ended up finding a dealer right on the St. Lawrence River in town that supplied exactly what I needed. One quart. :)

I don't know why I had it in my head that this was going to be hard, though I had to learn quickly that 20 minutes of viable pot life means you need to work FAST, no farting around. With drips and such I'll definitely need to sand and then re-apply the poly topcoat, but an additional coat all around won't be a bad thing. Since I had the epoxy, I was also able to fix a few other areas on the underside of the gunwales that had some small gaps where rain could work itself into. Next coat in 3 hours!


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PostPosted: July 3rd, 2019, 6:50 pm 
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Minor visual question. I'm starting to sand out the lumpiness of the new epoxy layers, and I have to feather in the new fiberglass that was laid on the nose and rear. Ended up doing two layers of glass on frontmost parts of the keel for added protection. The trouble I'm seeing is that I need to feather out the glass addition, but when I'm doing that, the fiberglass will keep a little bit of the "white square" look in places where the fiber has been partially sanded. It doesn't look like the poly does anything to hide it.

Is there a good way to polish out this visual imperfection in a way that it will be near invisible when all is said and done, or is it something I should just live with?


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PostPosted: July 4th, 2019, 5:03 am 
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Try wiping it with water, that will show you what it will look like after you revarnish it. Did you put some fill coats on top of the cloth once it was wetted out? Usually anywhere from 2 to 4 coats of epoxy are layed on after the wet out coat t fill in the weave. Then when you sand, you are smoothing the epoxy without contacting the glass.

When I do minor repairs, I'm usually not to careful about aesthetics. If you have given it a good sanding, the varnish will often be "good enough".


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PostPosted: July 4th, 2019, 9:07 am 
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What kind of canoe do you have recped? I like your style!


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PostPosted: July 4th, 2019, 10:40 am 
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Hazed_blue wrote:
Minor visual question. I'm starting to sand out the lumpiness of the new epoxy layers, and I have to feather in the new fiberglass that was laid on the nose and rear. Ended up doing two layers of glass on frontmost parts of the keel for added protection. The trouble I'm seeing is that I need to feather out the glass addition, but when I'm doing that, the fiberglass will keep a little bit of the "white square" look in places where the fiber has been partially sanded.


A little late to this, but using release treated peel ply eliminates most of those issues. Zero epoxy lumpiness, the cut edges of cloth or the selvage edge of glass tape will lay down flat and near invisible and even Dynel fabric, which “Swells up like an old sweatshirt, with the texture of 80 grit sandpaper”, compresses down flat and smooth under peel ply.

I will never again hand lay cloth and resin without using peel ply. If I don't have enough peel ply I'll order some and wait.


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PostPosted: July 4th, 2019, 5:57 pm 
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I used saran wrap with painters tape on my last repair. Actually had very good results for most of the patches. One was a little starved, but the others were brilliant.


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PostPosted: July 20th, 2019, 9:30 pm 
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Almost there. The fiberglassing visual ended up just fine. Few layers of poly absorbed right in there and you can hardly tell now with the way it blocks the reflection.

Now for the brass stem bands. Ordered them at 6', and they are pre-drilled 6" apart. (Saw that some recommend drilling after bending but hey, here we are.) Looking for recommendations on the best methods for bending and mounting. For ease and giving me the best chance at not snapping it, I'm going to align the band's so that the bend at the deck will be between two of the drill holes. A few sources recommend heating the brass to make the bend around the deck easier.

For mounting, I want to make sure that I can remove these in the case I need to do repairs down the road. I'm planning on drilling pilot holes, threading it with steel screws, and then removing those to replace with the brass/bronze ones. The screw holes are the biggest concern, providing a path for water to enter and all, so I'm thinking of handling it like I did the fixtures in my shower: packing it with silicone. Squirt a generous amount of silicone into the hole, and then put the screws in place before it dries. I could even do the same, using silicone as a bedding material on the backside of the band.

Does this sound like an alright plan? Any tips or pointers that I should consider?


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